Female riders

[MooN]

A reflexion generated by posts in the " your off road photos" section where, in replying to a post by one of the girls I found my self in a potential minefield.

With today's need for "political correctness" and the current trend for the public lynching of anybody accused of sexism or mysoginy ( I use the word accused advisedly as the lynching tends to take place based on accusation alone and the lives of the accused are often destroyed even if subsequently proved innocent) I found my self rewriting again and again what I wanted to say, desperately searching for any way in which my post could be misconstrued and provide offence, albeit perfectly unintentionally. I probably need, to avoid a lynching, to say here that I in no way shape or form, condone or accept any form of sexual harassement. I just find it a shame that being obliged to avoid any and all possibility of such accusation, it is easier to simply avoid any and all interaction. 

example: last week out by bike with friends we stopped for lunch and over the hour we spent at the lake a LOT of other groups turned up and picknicked, much as we were doing. Most of them younger than us and a group that came and sat near us had, surprisingly to me, a large proportion of girls obviously not passengers. There was an exchange of banter between us and sme of the lads as they walked past ( " oh god not more nasty hairy bikers!"... "no tables left I'm afraid but I can rent you this one..."  "there's been a release of prisoners at the kindergarten"... are some that I recall but I noticed that the girls were clearly not included in this exchange. and nobody, but nobody mentioned the fucking Elephant in the room ( ie that in a group of maybe 155 riders, more than half were girls which is just massively inhabituel here.)

I think that actually during at least 15 minutes there was not one single remark adressed to any of the girls present by our group. I also noticed that when we stopped for coffee a little later, there was much mention of that perticular group ( not in any sort of negative way at all), about the number of girls riding, their age ( much younger than us) and how much it was positive for biking in general and for girls on the whole. There was nothing mysogenistic about any of it so why had no one said anything to the girls? or to the group as a whole? 

In the same way, on websites or bike related pages, I have noticed that blokes liking comments from girl riders, or replying to girl riders will rapidly get some comment about how theyreply faster to grls than blokes, or more to girls than blokes or whatever. This is obviously counter productive as for fear of being misconstrued, I actively avoid, on certain sites, responding to posts from female riders. This is neither encouraging for the girls nor constructive for anybody else. 

re reading this, can I say "girls" as a collective noun without appearing derogatory? 

Is this just me being too cerebral and overthinking, and nobody else has a problem with this?

 

If this thread gets too stupid I wll ask admin to pull it. ( been there, done that elsewhere...) but I'm interested what you SOG's think and what the girls think ( but i can't ask them directly cos I'd be suspected of tring to chat them up or something...)

 

[Tym]

Im fortunete, since im so damn attractive im the one who's always sexually harrassed, i take it well, and i carry guns, lots of guns, people are perverts... 

[Tym]

What Busboy said was that if i posted nude pics we'd actually get more female riders, unlike his failed nude attempts to do the same 

[XTreme]

I think it's great to see more girls riding.......and not just the local type of riding that we do......real hardcore offroad and RTW!

And some of these ladies can REALLY ride.......the likes of us would never be able to do what they do.

And a lot of them seem to be really small.......for example there's Jess who you've seen on here, and Jocelin Snow........

And Stephanie Rowe.......

And Steph Jeavons (who's Welsh) who did a RTW trip solo on a CRF250L......

 

[Tym]

Meh, i've been riding with Tammy since03, and she can out wrench the lot of you...lol All you boys need is the right bait....

[Tym]

Check out Tammy's latest project bike, she will fix it for the fun of it. These are the type of girls to hang out with, we have to have standards 

 

 

,

[Pedro]

1 hour ago, MooN said:

There was nothing mysogenistic about any of it so why had no one said anything to the girls? or to the group as a whole? 

Women don't stop being women because they're on a bike. I find sexy as hell to see a woman confidently riding a bike, that didn't change. So same as you would do in any other social encounters, you play it cool and don't go saying "It's great that you galls are on bikes, good for you and for the humanity" because that would just make you sound like a self entitled dork to everyone, but to the ladies in particular. You play it cool so that they perceive you as if you didn't even notice them, because you want to get laid or at least not be ruled out of the game early on.

So basically, it's sex drive and basic attraction that makes us act politically correct 

[MooN]

1 hour ago, BusBoy said:

Oh christ. Get over yourself. It's a girl you blushing wallflower. They ride. It's not some alien specie out to conquer and subjugate you. I'm just surprised there are not more female riders. As a example I suspect horse riding has a far higher percentage of female riders so obviously there is a passion for that sort of thing inherent and it's the blustering male ego that wants to define the hobby as a male domain.

You missed the point, I have no problem talking to the girls, the problem is the potential consequences of that being misinterpreted. like I said you can't even reply to a girl riders post in some places without people calling you out as a lecher or a perv cos she's half your age and better looking than you are. This may be done originally as a jibe but are the sort of accusations that, even jokingly intended, can have serious consequences. 

[Pedro]

First time I was on a bike as an adult was at 16 or 17, on the back of a DT125 ridden by my girlfriend. So I'm plenty modern 

You don't admire a man riding a bike, so the only reason you admire a woman doing the same is because there is this thing about a woman doing something you like doing that does something for you. That's ok, I think.

[MooN]

58 minutes ago, Pedro said:

First time I was on a bike as an adult was at 16 or 17, on the back of a DT125 ridden by my girlfriend. So I'm plenty modern 

You don't admire a man riding a bike, so the only reason you admire a woman doing the same is because there is this thing about a woman doing something you like doing that does something for you. That's ok, I think.

Girls, holding their own and making their way in a male dominated milieu on equal terms on is admirable, be it on bikes or whatever else. It has nothing to do with their sex, or looks or whatever but because they are bucking the trend and breaking down barriers that have been  imposed by society for decades. 

for exactly the same reason I admire a blind person travelling alone, a physically disabled person carrying on as normal and doing stuff society doesn't expect. 

[MooN]

1 hour ago, Pedro said:

. You play it cool so that they perceive you as if you didn't even notice them, because you want to get laid or at least not be ruled out of the game early on.

 

erm... nope... but that's exactly my point. Tht is what everybody automatically assumes. 

[Pedro]

31 minutes ago, MooN said:

Girls, holding their own and making their way in a male dominated milieu on equal terms on is admirable

for exactly the same reason I admire a blind person travelling alone, a physically disabled person carrying on as normal and doing stuff society doesn't expect. 

To me that doesn't make sense, a girl is a person that decides to ride a bike or drive a car then I just hope she enjoys whatever. In my eyes, a woman in europe can pretty much do what she wants, that barrier has fallen as far as I can tell.

Can't compare that challenge of what is basically someone just doing something for fun with no real obstacles getting in her way to the one that is presented to a disabled person just moving around the world. 

Now, get a blind girl riding a bike to a gathering and you've got something ...

[MooN]

Ok. Ill try to explain myself better. 
 

my original point was that To avoid the risk of giving a percieved offence we say nothing.  A sad state of affairs that suits mo ones purpose. 
 

and if you think that sexual stereotyping is dead in the workplace im Europe you are very wrong my friend. I am currently helping 3 teenage daughters with their career choices.... believe you me sexism is alive and well in the career world. 
 

I also had to get rid of my best mechanic last year, fired for sexual harrassement in the workplace. Hes 10 yrs younger than me so its not just the “old guard” either. 

[Pedro]

I didn't say there is no sexual stereotyping or harassment, or even violence against women. I live in Portugal, probably worse but surely no better than France. Granted, they might not even be taken seriously when walking into a motorcycle dealership, sure.

BUT, nothing stops or makes it more difficult for a woman to learn to ride, buy a bike and go on leisure rides like most men. 

[Tym]

1 hour ago, Pedro said:

I

BUT, nothing stops or makes it more difficult for a woman to learn to ride, buy a bike and go on leisure rides like most men. 

Not Tammy, she carries a gun and is almost 7 feet tall...not all women are created equal ya know...lol

[XTreme]

1 hour ago, MooN said:

my original point was that To avoid the risk of giving a percieved offence we say nothing.  A sad state of affairs that suits mo ones purpose. 

I'm a bit confused by this thread really.

I don't see any riders out.....let alone females........but if I did I'd behave just as I would with a man.

I don't see there's any difference really.......if I spoke to a woman why would she think I was trying to chat her up? In the same way as if I spoke to a man why would he think I'm grooming him?

If we look at what we know so far about you and your French mates, it appears to be that they don't want to go anywhere that's too hot, they don't want to go anywhere where there's foreigners, they don't want to go anywhere where people are not speaking French, and they don't want to go anywhere where there's women? 

Have you ever considered the possibility that all of you are seriously weird fuckers? 

What do you make of this Frenchy shit @Tym?

[Tym]

18 minutes ago, XTreme said:

 

What do you make of this Frenchy shit @Tym?

Well, my oldest brother is a French National, when he took the test it was in French, they drilled him a new a hole, cost him a fortune cause he had to marry a French Girl in the first place, it wouldnt be so hard on the family butt, she's Parisian, and they talk funny even by French standards.....

 

 Normal French people arnt so bad butt the Paris types, oy vey. All i had to do to be in the EU was pay Ire Land $164...Whats the topic? France? Best grilled cheese sandmiches anywhere 

[XTreme]

Just now, Tym said:

Well, my oldest brother is a French National, when he took the test it was in French, they drilled him a new a hole, cost him a fortune cause he had to marry a French Girl in the first place, it wouldnt be so hard on the family butt, she's Parisian, and they talk funny even by French standards.....

 

 Normal French people arnt so bad butt the Paris types, oy vey. All i had to do to be in the EU was pay Ire Land $164...Whats the topic? France? Best grilled chees sandmiches anywhere 

Why did he get French citizenship?

[Tym]

He married a French girl, back in the 80's, why not? Ca Va? lol

[Tym]

PS, dont forget the USA allows for you to be a dual national, so being french or Irish at the same time isnt a big deal...

[Sir Fallsalot]

@MooN I know exactly what your talking about but for me its just internet based, face to face i'll talk to anyone.

[Pedro]

1 hour ago, XTreme said:

In the same way as if I spoke to a man why would he think I'm grooming him?

Maybe stop looking at their crotches, eyes are up here!

[Buckster]

Women on motorcycles? Pfffftttt! Next they will be allowed to vote.

[Buckster]

So @MooN have you dragged yourself into the 21st century yet or do you still think female riders are such an anomaly that they need special mention?

[MooN]

10 hours ago, Buckster said:

So @MooN have you dragged yourself into the 21st century yet or do you still think female riders are such an anomaly that they need special mention?

you too have ;isconstrued my original point, but I can't see who to explain myself better.

more sucinctly perhaps would be : some people prefer to avoid any interaction, for fear of giving offence or being accused of giving offence. Am i the only one who percieves this?