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Covid! What are you allowed to do?


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1 hour ago, Slowlycatchymonkey said:

I understand the sentiment but its not the antivaxers who cause the lockdowns and its knock on effects, its the folk who govern over you. Why go out of your way to try and piss off the antivaxers? Smacks of flexing a bit too far and punishing the majority in the process. 

Antivaxers have had far far too much attention and Macron is stoking their righteous fire. Why? Antivaxers remind me of bad dogs that have learnt any attention is better than none, its time to ignore it, they’ll come to heel or disappear.

They’ve made their choice (personally I believe in the right to govern your own body) so let them get on with it. If they die thats.. their choice same as its been with every other vaccine for well over 100 years. Just now its a political football and as long as everyone’s focussed on Covid theyre not looking at any other problems including their wonderful leaders.

 So I suppose Im agreeing with you entirely but from a different perspective. Macron (any leader) should leave people to make up their own minds even if that mind is dull and let them get on with the consequences. 

"antivaxxers" is maybe not the right term as it evokes the rabid eejits who want to convert all and sundry to their cause, I mean those who refuse the vaccine on fallacious grounds. I understand the ethical problems linked to any limitation of freedom of choice but,  it looks like ( from where I'm standing) that the freedom of choice of  a small percentage of the populatoion is being valued more highly than the freedom of choice of a huge majority who want to be able to go to work, live without a mask, be able to see their family and travel freely.  Please undesrtand I make no moral judgement here, I simply say that this is NOT how democracy is supposed to work. 

democracy in it's simplest form is  "majority rule", though some would say that democracy is simply the tyranny of the majority over the wishes of the minority, 

Macron is not proposing compulsory vaccination ( he couldn't get away with that) but he is proposing that the covid pass becomes a vaccin pass, so those who are unvaccinated can no longer  access bars, clubs, restaurants, cinemas,  etc etc etc but those who have a full schema vaccinal can.  Seems fair to me, with no vaccination these venues were closed to everybody anyway, with a vaccination they bagan to re open but are now closing again due, in majority, to people who refuse to get vaccinated, if that is their preference then fine but they mustn't impose their choice on the rest of us , they can remain unvaccinated whilst we get on with our lives.  remember that in the UK the treatement of the unvaccinated is paid for out of your taxes. In many parts of the world (france for example) that is not the case ( or only partly)  and we pay insurance for health care. Those insurance premiums are going to skyrocket in order to pay for the treatment of the unvaccinated and whilst I am happy to pay for people who are genuinely sick, I struggle to justify doing so for those who make a conscious decision to refuse a preventive treatement and subsequently fall ill  as a direct result of that decision. 

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24 minutes ago, Catteeclan said:

Just read on another forum that France have a new variant.

oooh, not heard that one, any sources cited ( other than " somebody told me he read it on facebook?) It's not on the news sources here yet

the latest INFOX seems to be that "immigrants constitute 50% of covid deaths in France" and that tap water is covid positive... 

 

 the only references I can find to a new variant in france are english, the only reference I can find in French relate to a varient back in november last year. The uk sites seem to report a variant imported from the Cameroons (?) even more infectious than Omicron, affecting 10 or 12 patients in the marseille area. I have no idea how reliable or not these sources might be. 

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18 minutes ago, MooN said:

"antivaxxers" is maybe not the right term as it evokes the rabid eejits who want to convert all and sundry to their cause, I mean those who refuse the vaccine on fallacious grounds. I understand the ethical problems linked to any limitation of freedom of choice but,  it looks like ( from where I'm standing) that the freedom of choice of  a small percentage of the populatoion is being valued more highly than the freedom of choice of a huge majority who want to be able to go to work, live without a mask, be able to see their family and travel freely.  Please undesrtand I make no moral judgement here, I simply say that this is NOT how democracy is supposed to work. 

democracy in it's simplest form is  "majority rule", though some would say that democracy is simply the tyranny of the majority over the wishes of the minority, 

Macron is not proposing compulsory vaccination ( he couldn't get away with that) but he is proposing that the covid pass becomes a vaccin pass, so those who are unvaccinated can no longer  access bars, clubs, restaurants, cinemas,  etc etc etc but those who have a full schema vaccinal can.  Seems fair to me, with no vaccination these venues were closed to everybody anyway, with a vaccination they bagan to re open but are now closing again due, in majority, to people who refuse to get vaccinated, if that is their preference then fine but they mustn't impose their choice on the rest of us , they can remain unvaccinated whilst we get on with our lives.  remember that in the UK the treatement of the unvaccinated is paid for out of your taxes. In many parts of the world (france for example) that is not the case ( or only partly)  and we pay insurance for health care. Those insurance premiums are going to skyrocket in order to pay for the treatment of the unvaccinated and whilst I am happy to pay for people who are genuinely sick, I struggle to justify doing so for those who make a conscious decision to refuse a preventive treatement and subsequently fall ill  as a direct result of that decision. 

Do you feel that way about old folk who dont have the flu vaccine? Or any vaccine for that matter. Or people who choose to take part in risky activities?

Not wanting to sound inflammatory, I take your point but what price freedom. As soon as you start applying value judgements to peoples life choices based on money theres a whole raft of things that should be stopped immediately. Most of them recreation related.

All nutters with a cause need is someone to take them seriously and fan the flames. If everyone said “Ok its your choice” they’d go back to the conspiracy theory campaigning that make us all laugh instead of cry.

Tin Foil Sparkle GIF by WENS

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9 minutes ago, Mawsley said:

Yes, because their stupidity impacts on society. Being a Dunning-Kruger window licker doesn't give them a free pass.

It's not about lifestyle choices in general, nobody has ever died from second-hand nude bungie jumping. Fuck, I've tried but high velocity breasts just leave a red mark on your face.

So youre saying we can kill the stupid people.. finally something I can fully back.

shooting machine gun GIF

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2 minutes ago, Slowlycatchymonkey said:

So youre saying we can kill the stupid people.. finally something I can fully back.

shooting machine gun GIF

Couldn't agree more, the world needs a good culling of its various idiots, let's start with government 

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6 minutes ago, Slowlycatchymonkey said:

👏 👏 👏 Get Tym n Tammy on board, we need the expertise.. and access the semi automatic weapons 😆 

The late, great George Carlin came up with the solution years ago.....

 

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1 minute ago, Mawsley said:

This country is crying out for a Purge night.

Im all for that, my son said someone suggested it would be a little earner, forget about revenge or the greater good, harvest organs, a mere kidney goes for about $200,000 imagine how much a liver, heart or lung would fetch. Quids in.

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43 minutes ago, Slowlycatchymonkey said:

Im all for that, my son said someone suggested it would be a little earner, forget about revenge or the greater good, harvest organs, a mere kidney goes for about $200,000 imagine how much a liver, heart or lung would fetch. Quids in.

So NHS nurse and part time grave robber eh

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5 hours ago, MooN said:

 

I dunno what the fuss is about, he only dared to say what the majority are thinking, that's how democracy is supposed to work isn't it? 

 

Yes, and its called the tyranny of the majority, and its why the united states is a Republic.

 

Individual liberty trumps your socialism.

 

😃

 

 

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16 minutes ago, Richzx6r said:

So NHS nurse and part time grave robber eh

And Ive left the NHS Im now just on the emergency Covid register. If I was still registered talking the way I do on here would get me in trouble, conduct unbecoming n all that 😂 

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2 hours ago, MooN said:

oooh, not heard that one, any sources cited ( other than " somebody told me he read it on facebook?) It's not on the news sources here yet

the latest INFOX seems to be that "immigrants constitute 50% of covid deaths in France" and that tap water is covid positive... 

 

 the only references I can find to a new variant in france are english, the only reference I can find in French relate to a varient back in november last year. The uk sites seem to report a variant imported from the Cameroons (?) even more infectious than Omicron, affecting 10 or 12 patients in the marseille area. I have no idea how reliable or not these sources might be. 

He's a nurse on the TDM forum, not known for talking crap even though he's from the capital of Ireland.:classic_laugh:

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12 minutes ago, Slowlycatchymonkey said:

Well precision butchery fetches a good price on the blackmarket and Id be providing a service to inhumanity so wotcha gonna do? 

Alice In Wonderland Shrug GIF

Maybe I'll join in with the butchery 

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1 hour ago, Slowlycatchymonkey said:

Do you feel that way about old folk who dont have the flu vaccine? Or any vaccine for that matter. Or people who choose to take part in risky activities?

Not wanting to sound inflammatory, I take your point but what price freedom. As soon as you start applying value judgements to peoples life choices based on money theres a whole raft of things that should be stopped immediately. Most of them recreation related.

All nutters with a cause need is someone to take them seriously and fan the flames. If everyone said “Ok its your choice” they’d go back to the conspiracy theory campaigning that make us all laugh instead of cry.

 

old folk not having their flu vaccine does not endanger the entire country's economy or oblige the rest of the population to stay at home to avoid catching it.

I used the money argument because the vast majority of political level decisions are based solely on this criteria, morality or ethics doesn't bear any weight today when there are millions in question.  Untill the covid problem is resolved, most recreational activities are stopped or vastly restricted ( but I take your point though am not scholar enough to make a coherent or non hypocrital response)

there are many obligatory vaccinations that are , or were, obligatory in order to eradicate a world wide desease ( polio, german measles etc)

5 million French over 14's are not vaccinated. that's about 8,percent of the population.  if you remove the million or so who can't be vaccinated for medically justifiable reasons then it's even less.  it just seems unjustifiable that the country is being destroyed in the name of freedom of choice for 8 % of the population. 

 I do like the TNT suggestion though...  😂 

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2 hours ago, Slowlycatchymonkey said:

👏 👏 👏 Get Tym n Tammy on board, we need the expertise.. and access the semi automatic weapons 😆 

 I decided right from the start that I was not going to participate with covid I never missed a day of work "Jeff needs his money" I never stopped seeing my kids family and friends and I haven't stopped riding with my friends in the woods.

As for the government and all the people who have no mind of their own time will take care of them.

I'm 58 married for the 2nd time in the middle of this shit show I have a job that is not going anywhere thanks to most of you. I have guns and ammo and can reload everything I have more than 2 times I have all the new motorcycles I will ever need before my lungs give up on me. I have 8 grandchildren to love and over the years I've learned that no one is better than the person next to them and what they think of me is as important as how I feel about about my last BM.

Life is short and my drums sound awesome to me as they have all of my life.

Live your life your way and and don't worry about the lives you have nothing to do with and you will be a happy motorcycle riding retard like me just not as sexy 😉

 

Guns = food and safety.....

The government is cancer it will eat itself no need for my help..

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